Rotterdam Travel Forum

Hello all,

We arrive tomorrow morning between 9 and 10 (depending on train connections being late or not) to Rotterdam Centraal. We have to reach following address (the logistics did change since I asked last time...)

Seattleweg 17
3195 ND Rotterdam

What is the best way to do?

Thanks!

The only bus that goes there is nr. 69 (from Metro Zuidplein), but this bus only runs mornings and afternoons. You arrive in Rotterdam to late to be able to use it. You will probably have to take a taxi.
You could take the metro to Rhoon, and either walk or take a a taxi from there, but then you have to make sure you know the taxi company's phone nr.

Seattleweg is at Pernis-Rotterdam.

Here's the whole journey:

Departure 8:18 hrs Trainstation Centraal Utrecht
platform 9
Arrival Rotterdam Central, platform 13, 8:57
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Dpearture 9:02 Centraal Rotterdam, platform 8
Arrival 9:07 Schiedam Centrum, platform 5
(train direction Den Haag Centraal)
---------

Departure 9:12 metro Schiedam centrum
Arrival 9:20 metro Pernis
---------

9:36 metrostation pernis
9:47 Bus 69 to Seattleweg (direction Rotterdam)
---------
Departure 9:47 seattleweg
Arrival: 9:49 (2 min. walk)

The route by road from Rotterdam Central station to Seattleweg is 12 kms.
A taxi would cost approx. 30 euro (7,50 starting rate incl. first 2 kms, 2.20 euro per km). The meter should not run at red traffic lights or in case of traffic jams. Hence the high starting rate. And so the 30 euro should be pretty precise.

It's a challange indeed (visiting Eucon Intermodal B.V. at Pernis):


Last morning public transportation:

9:02 treinstation Centraal track 8 stoptrein direction Den Haag centraal

9:07 treinstation Centrum Schiedam track 5
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
9:12 metro schiedam centrum: Caland metro direction Spijkenisse

9:20 metro Pernis Rotterdam ret
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
9:36 metrostation pernis: Stadbus 69 direction Rotterdam

9:47 seattleweg
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2 minutes walking


Next connection starts at 14.28


PJ

O boy, Beating ATLC at her homebase seems impossible :)

LOL



PJ

LOL. Good on you for trying, PJ :-)

I think I was too curious for what company was involved.

2 points for you!


PJ

guys, thanks a lot, we are right now at the train station in APPLE dealership where internet connection is free.... but it's 10:04 AM. Thanks again! (we are going to arrange the car import with the freight agency if anyone is curious...)

It's not that company, it's World Freight Logistics BV

yes, I remember your previous question. Hope everything works out.
From Pernis you could take the A15 towards Europoort (direction west) and turn off at Rozenburg to take a car ferry to Maassluis and from there on back to Rotterdam or wherever. It's only a 10 minute drive from the address in Pernis.

Since you mentioned a car ferry before... the cost is I think 3.50 euro (car + two passengers) and takes about eh...5-10 minutes. I always use it in case of rush hours.

Why not going for a cup of coffee at ATLC's? :)


PJ

Now, I see:

World Freight Logistics B.V. , Seattleweg 17, Bldg 4, 7th Floor

There will be a lot of different companies there.


PJ

Wow, now we are back. Sorry to miss everyone in NL: it will come... and our time was filled with stress. Luckily it ended up more-less OK.

Here is what happened:

- We arrived in the morning (of course just missing the bus 69). Found the tourist office (somewhat helpful), the banks (very unhelpful to change two 500 Euros into smaller) and Apple dealer at the station (very-very helpful, got Internet connection where we stayed connected)

- We went as far with the "blue" metro as it did make sense (no 69!); first found few taxis ("oh, how much you have to pay us? 50 Euro is OK?"), than going somewhat further let call a restaurant the taxi (11 Euros, gave 14 Euros).

- The company was not-so-helpful and charged a LOT more than agreed - because they conveniently forgot the VAT from their offer - for the car preparation. It turned to be over 500 Euro.

- The horror stories NL customs were just that: horror fairy-tales. They were pretty friendly, fast, efficient and acted according the law.

But: it was close to the end of the day as all paperwork for the car was done. It was a very exhausting day and the hotel the logistics company suggested us turned out to be pretty bad. Luckily, there was a REALLY GREAT hotel almost next to it for 75 Euro - and we hit the bed. There was no free internet tough, so my connection with VT and outside world was lost. :(

- Next day we woke up (to miss the 69 again - but luckily there was #68, almost as good). Armed with TomTom (did not work perfectly!), the paper from customs and umbrella we reached the place where the car#3 was stored. No problems, except that some idiot did not know how to operate the automatic transmission of a KIA and made a scratch on the plastic plate. Not a big issue - not sure, it was in the States or in NL.

- As usual we were horribly late till everything settled, so we decided to postpone any VT - meetings... and run to Bremerhaven to pick up the car#2. TomTom was good, but it did lead us to some surprises (like a place without bridge in Bremerhaven). Of course, we were already late there ..... darn, but at least found the building where to start from (and a basic but still OK hotel in the middle of the city)

- The next day was the day of insanity. Everything what can go wrong did went wrong. Luckily, the car arrived where it should, we eventually did not pay any caution and/or duty (despite initial demands of German customs) and we found the place where the car#2 can be repaired. At a certain moment it looked not very good as a customs official demanded caution while the car was leaking some greenish fluid and the battery died. I would say, for beginners, Rotterdam is much better choice than Bremerhaven simply because simultan speaking German and Russian is not the requirement to advancing. In Bremerhaven without active German language skills (arguing with customs) and fluent Russian (a Georgian guy who helped the car to start at least) the situation would look pretty sad.

At the end we formed a caravan with a slowly crawling car#3 in the front, some mad drivers in the middle and the car#2 following the line... till we found a repair shop who knew how to deal with Audi-s leaking coolant. It also turned out, that Audi parts are much cheaper in Germany than in the States (what a surprise!) and that in it's 11 year history our Audi never seen a mechanic who even remotely knew Audi. (The German mechanic had some very kind words about the level of Audi-understanding in the States). We decided to leave the car#2 for at least one day and went to an other hotel.

Next morning we visited "our" mechanic again, the basic issue was fixed, but he suggested to look through the car because I complained about other minor annoyances accumulated in 11 year history and he had one remark, too. Car is basically OK, just 63000 miles and clean - but it would not hurt to go through minor details. So we agreed, he will keep the car for a week and we go home.

In the evening I successfully loaded the car#3 on ARZ (Autoreisezug) in Hamburg and we went.... till shortly after Passau where a train before us de-railed. :(

After more-less successfully upsetting everyone with my "skills" to load-unload the car from the train and scaring half of Southern Slovakia (to avoid toll roads in Austria and Hungary), the car#3 did arrive.... today in the evening.

So we spent almost a week running like a madman between BG, BP, Rotterdam, Bremerhaven, Hamburg, Vienna, BP... and dealing with army of different officials, logistics agencies, custom officials, etc, etc, etc.

The forever question: "IS IT WORTH TO BRING A CAR FROM USA TO EUROPE?" can be answered with definitive: "absolutely yes, if you have spare two weeks, can navigate a suitcase of paperwork in 2-3 languages, can talk yourself out of some very persistent German custom officials /in German!/, can talk /in Russian/ some Georgians to help with your car problems, can get all "green card" information you need from some secretive GEICO agents and finally prove to some DB ticket agents that what they know about train tickets is wrong". After all of that we analyzed, we made at least 3-4 critical mistakes and could save 300-400 Dollars if we knew ahead of time.

Just in case, this is overwhelming: American tourists can short-term/middle-term lease a brand new car from Peugeot or Renault. Expats or some crazy people can proceed differently.

More details to follow, this is just preliminary. Thanks everyone for help and sorry from ATLC we could not meet her this time :(

Thanks for the update. It's a good one about the VAT. It is a critical mistake that Dutchies (and others) make, who are not business-owners, make. They are used to buying stuff inclusive of VAT at retailers.
At non-retail or business-to-business transactions, it is common not to mention the 6% or 19% VAT as both parties know that is on added on anyway.
Possibly you can get a return on your VAT at customs, when you show your bill. This goes for other countries too.

Amazing story and good you had some valueable lessons learned.

About the Dutch VAT. To me it seems you exported your car from the netherlands and should get the VAT back somehow (even more paperwork).

Do you still have to have these cars so local approval tests.

I know imported US cars needs different blinker lights (orange i.s.o. red) in Holland and also the chassis number location is an issue.
Getting your car in the right (cheapest) road tax category is another game to play.


Hope to see you around in less stressful times,

PJ

Luckily, it was not a VAT for any good (like car) - we could not afford it at that time. It was merely VAT for the "work" of the agent (an extra 80 Euro tax for a "work" where you pay 450 Euro while it's YOU who tells what THEM what to do! ), not a big deal, but important to note for anyone who intent to count all the beans involved. I.e. who imports the car should be not surprised first, to be asked for ca. 450 for nothing, and than pay 540 or so later instead of ca. 450.

But from our experience, this is still the simplest.

Case/1: the "victim" is going to a place in Bremen (NOT Bremerhaven!). The agents are very helpful, the customs officials very helpful and acting according the law, the unloading and preparation fee TOTALS ca. 420 Euro - but the car has to be loaded on a truck and transported from Bremerhaven to Bremen and it is stored for extensive period of time (2-3 days) in a TIGHT parking lot. That means: while everything is simpler, there is a high probability of fender scratches on the new car and to fix them is expensive.

Case/2: the "victim" is going to Rotterdam. The agents are pretty indifferent at best, they charge ca. 100 Euro more than it is charged in Bremen, the customs are very easy to deal with, the car is not trucked anywhere, it is driven out of the container practically at the spot. There won't be any scratches, but if car controls are unusual, the workers do not seem to be very knowledgeable ( = tape some things down and write in big letters, how to operate the car!)

Case/3: the "victim" is going to Bremerhaven, not Bremen. There is not much an agent will do there and they are even cheaper (350 Euro). Like in Rotterdam, the cars are driven locally, not trucked. The drivers are Georgians or Moldavians and they are pretty knowledgeable about the cars and more helpful than some bozos who scratched the dashboard of our car in Rotterdam (presumably). To cover the distances in Bremerhaven the "victim" will need a helper and an other car (rental or otherwise). To deal with customs is a pure nightmare and requires strong language skills + self-determination + being armed with the information from the customs head office in Frankfurt.



So here are some more advices:
-------------------------

I) the car importer (from European point of view) is the best if he deals with guys in Bremen ( best is Interfracht Logistics, http://www.interfracht.de/index.php?id=1&L=1 ) or maybe the World Freight Logistics in Rotterdam, http://www.wfl.nl/pages/english.php

II) AVOID LIKE PLAGUE: to deal with any company in USA.

According to Moldavian girl who works in Bremerhaven, what is possible to screw up, it DOES happen if the American agent is the prime reference (the company you have contract with). Luckily in our case the cars weren't re-routed to an other city by mistake and charged 2000 Euro extra for nothing (we did witness it) and other fine stuff. But who does it next time, be in contract with European company and deal with their agents in USA, not the other way.

III) We are very-very cheap, so we decided to take maritime insurance for the car. Pay that $300-$400 extra. Bad things do happen.

IV) Customs in Germany and Netherlands will not let your car roll out the office until you do not have insurance. The lady at Intarfracht was nice, we saved a lot of time by her releasing the car BEFORE the customs did see it and her being in our car and navigating us through the city TO THE CUSTOMS. But she can't do anything and car won't leave the office if it does not have the insurance.

The most important document is essentially that small green piece of paper.... no green card = no car.

(for Americans: navigate through "GEICO OVERSEAS" nightmare and be patient. For others: no idea, maybe American International Underwriters, but they are 40% more expensive).

V) Cover critical edges of the car bumper. Just in case some idiot will scratch it in the parking lot and run away.

VI) Do not forget: there are many "car trains" in Europe, you can save time and money by putting your car in the back of the train (30-100 Euro) and sleep in the front of the train. It will come out cheaper than the gas and faster.

VII) Have enough time, expect to spend ca. 1 week/car delivery event

VIII) DO NOT GO ALONE TO TAKE YOUR CAR, it's not just safer to be in a small gang, but more people catch more information and everyone may have it's designated task.

IX) While in America, buy a Garmin or TomTom or Magellan navigator devices through Amazon.com, any (American) version is fine, than pay on-line to the manufacturer and download the maps from their web site. It's cheaper than buying one in Europe and you will need both American and European maps at one point. There is not much difference which is which, make sure it's the cheapest wide-screen tough. BTW: forget eBay, Amazon is more reliable source, you get it faster and often cheaper than after a "bidding war". While buying, calculate the "whole thing" you likely may need i.e. USA map + Canada map + WEurope map + EEurope map + device, not the device alone!

NEVER EVER go for a trap and rely on free "pirated" maps. Besides ethical concerns and siding with "dark force", these maps are outdated and even the newest ones aren't perfect always. A one year old "downloadwarez" map is not worth the trouble. For the same reason: buy the newest maps, don't try to save $30 and buy a used one on eBay.

I would still check if you can get that VAT back. It may not matter if it is on goods or services.
It doesn't for Dutch citizens: I deliver only services. The VAT I receive and the VAT I pay are balanced and the difference I either get back or I pay to fiscal office. My client will do the same, if he/she has a business.

How about leaving the cars inside the container up to their final destination?
Could be transported by river-container-ship and do the final customs clearance in a small town.


PJ

Thanks guys, we will try with that VAT refund once the dust sets. One is clear after that: there are several ways to arrange and for dual citizen/long-time resident/expat/perpetual tourist it makes sense, esp. if they have moving experience and much time flexibility.

There was recently a question of a short-term tourist who wanted to try out his Merc on the Autobahn and had only two weeks in Europe to spend. Here the obvious answer is to chose the most reliable rental agency and rent a "twin" of his car locally. Much easier to arrange and much cheaper.


The Georgian guy also told me, some cars like Jaguar are the worst to ship: some models can't open the trunk only electrically, but (see my long rambling) the people who work at docks are not the most knowledgeable about cars. They suppose to run the fuel level at 1/4th of the tank first, than disconnect the car battery before shipping the car. They are lazy to do the first (all our cars arrived with the same fuel level as shipped!) and if they can't find the battery (like in Audi or Jaguar) they will leave it to die.

The Georgian guy told me, nearly all cars arrive from the States with a dead battery. In the case of Audi I just have to remove the back seat and replace (109 Euro) the dead battery. For Jaguar he has to call a local Jaguar d€€€al€€€r$$$$$hip. They will come, tow the car, do some work and produce a "nice" extra invoice to the owner. We used to buy remanufactured batteries in the States from Kragen Autoparts store chain (very cheap, low quality) - not much loss, but frustration.

Forgot to add few more advice to the long list:


- Autoclub membership!

CAA/AAA/ADAC/etc. membership can be worth pure gold (sorry: pure Euros) because anything may happen. We were lucky to be able to drive the car for few miles to the next Audi mechanic and the customs were kind enough (after initial arguments regarding paying/non-paying caution/VAT/duty) to allow our disabled car stay on their lot till we did not return with new battery. A broken 30-Euro triviality (electric component) caused the water overheat, but it could be more. With reasonable towing and other services car club membership may save huge initial expenses.

- REMOVE THESE BEAUTIFUL USA LICENSE PLATES BEFORE SHIPPING THE CAR!!!

Some American license plates are a huge eye-candy for collectors. Customs won't allow the car leave the area without license plates and you may get a nasty surprise taking the car delivery: the license plates "walked away" due collector's zeal. :(
Remove the plates in USA, take them (in carry-on luggage of course!), than bring to the customs to avoid surprises.

- BRING SOME BASIC TOOLS! (so you can replace the battery, re-install the license plates, tighten what is lose)

- As said, expect to spend the entire day. If you don't have a car already delivered, think about renting a basic one for the day to run errands.


* V * E * R * Y * * I * M * P * O * R * T * A * N * T *

In Bremerhaven you can leave Germany without even noticing! Some parts of the city (harbor area) are duty-free area. Normally it's not a problem... unless your vehicle you use to run errands is a non-EU vehicle. We run into that problem that the customs did not wanted to let us back at a harmlessly looking corner - until we produced the proof about our pre-existing car being already handled in Netherlands.

Who is driving around Bremerhaven and has US license plates: better to look for small signs like "Zoll", stop at these signs and ask to issue a free entry-exit permit for the car (to prevent arguments during the exit). Not a big deal, takes 5 minutes at maximum and saves headache. The problem is, every sign is in German and English skills of older officers are somewhat limited.

The last time I saw the ZOLL sign was in Hamburg and I was in the third lane.
Well, no problem, I just went to a small office at the other side of the free-tax-zone the next day.

The problems came afterwards: We had a system modification: 5 slow computer boards out; 4 new fast ones in. Try to explaine the difference in quantity to the German tax officer.


PJ