Saint Petersburg Travel Forum

I'm considering attending a Russian language school in St. Petersburg from March 10 2008 - May 10th 2008. This being said, the school has offered me my choice of Moscow or St. Petersburg. Can anyone tell me if one city is safer for foreigners than another?

Oh by the way - I'm not a young student...just young at heart.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Also, being a Canadian I'm not afraid of the weather in St. Petersburg in March, I have an idea of what to expect.

Thanks in advance for any and all advice etc...

Russia is a safe place for young women you will be respected when you are out I have been to both Moscow and St Petersburg I would recomend St Petersburg the main reason is that you wont have to go through Moscow Airport
and when you get there try the mushroom flavoured chips I bring back boxes of them when I go to eastern europe

Both are very "unsafe". People over there enjoy blowing up Moscow-SPB trains. An other week - an other train is blown up. Older bombs are sold everywhere in grocery stores for Roubles with big discount, but the latest designer models with plastic explosives only in GUM and only for hard currency. It is a century-old national tradition. Punks and neonazis are figting each other everywhere and the national tradition is, every foreigner who enters the country is beaten at the customs. Sorry to be so cynic... But you know... Fox News rarely reports:

"In Moscow near Kremlin in the middle of Manezhnaya Square a bunch of Chechens are dancing, a blond Russian kid plays with guys from Caucasus"

like here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8SV5g-O9MU

it's boring and difficult to sell.

Gunning down a schoolclass is also rather untypical for U.S. - and here Fox News & co. is also doing the "best" job spreading the "joy" worldwide. Probably because the news like "8 year old M. Gonzales from East San Jose again solved a math problem the high scool students could not solve" is also boring news, who wants to know about it?

Chosing between SPB and Moscow is not easy - the safety concerns are the last thing to consider.

- Look in details about curriculum, opinions of the students, quality of the teachers. After all, it's your money and you want to get best out of it.
- Look for accomodation. That's the second thing. Where and what is offered?
- Look for the environment. Moscow is the "old capital" with a lot (but not all!) "Russian Fairytale" cities relatively close ("Golden Ring"). SPB is built for more "European" taste. But some "fairytale" cities are closer to SPB than to Moscow (Novgorod, for instance).
- Moscow is much bigger - but more stressful, some people say "crazy". But: the weather is probably more pleasant in Moscow.

Ok, I obvously haven't explained my circumstances well enough so let me try again.

After a great amount of research and contacting 10 different Russian Language training schools (much like when I went to university 20 years ago) I have made and informed decision on a school. Now all I have to do is decide on the city to study in as this school offers courses in both St. Petersburg and Moscow. Fortunately, I am Canadian and live in Canada and thus do not get FOX and therefore I do not believe myself to have a twisted sence of what is happening in the country.

If you asked me which city was safer for a lone 40 yr old woman, Toronto or Ottawa, it would be simple...Ottawa. The crime rate is lower.

That didn't come out quite the way I meant it...especially with all the typo's.

I should never write messages on forums at 2:30 in the morning.

Ok what I meant to say was: Thank you everyone for your help and advice. It is greatly appreciated. After the thanks...then the reply about FOX and research etc...

Both cities are safe. You will find in general that Russian cities are safer than places in many (most?) other countries. I wouldn't walk around alone at 3 AM (although back in the 1980s and early 1990s you could do this in Moscow with no concern whatsoever), but I wouldn't do that anywhere.

The weather will be marginally better in Moscow but neither place is much fun at that time of year--March/April is the most depressing time to be there, IMO. Cold, ice, and slush are what you will find, and it's still dark all the time.

March and April is NOT "still dark all the time". In the beginning of April in St. Petersburg, sunset is after 9 p.m.

The chances to get into a traffic accident in Moscow and being overrun by a car driven by an unexperienced driver are thousand times higher than become a victim of a wicked crime. Watch out for traffic, do not jaywalk and never let your guard down regarding minor scams.

As everywhere in East Europe, "serious crime" most of the time happens within the family (like mama found papa in her bed with somebody else, she hit him on his head with bottle and he died). "wicked crime" (serial killers, cannibals, etc.) is much less common than in any country on American continent (puritanism was not invented in Russia).

it seems here is my favorite question, is Russia safe or not. Agree with opinion above, that Russian cities are safer than many European (at least, I had some stories in Europe, even in Paris, although I didn't look for troubles). In Russia, if you don't look for troubles you will not find them. Besides schools will rather offer a place to live somewhere not far from the center and it is completely safe (as it was said above, it is still possible walking at night time in Moscow without problems. the same I did in StP and hadn't problems too).
Great you will be able to see both cities.

:-))) in my opinion Moscow is more conservative city :-) StP seems to me more open and changable with different European influence. In my opinion StP is the most European style city in Russia.
There are some interesting places like museums or theatres or other cultural places that worth visiting both in Moscow and in StP, and I can't choose one city. For example, I prefer to see football match in Moscow but to go to StP to see opera, because Mariinsky is the best opera theatre in Russia. :-)))
in any way, it is aspects that is a bit far from the discussion of this forum. So, both cities are safe :-)

Bravo :-)))
I agree at all now :-))) you're completely right!!!!! :-))))

i am just bookmarking here because i am longing to go to St P ever since seeing Russian Ark.

Good morning!

Thank you everyone for your replies. I understand what everyone is saying regarding remaining safe in the cities etc.
I would imagine the bottom line is - just don't be an arrogant/idiotic tourist and you'd be ok! :-)

The school I have chosen offers the option of spending one month in St. Petersburg and one month in Moscow and this is what I have chosen to do. I want to experience the best of both cities.

As much as St. Petersburg interests me, I'm a huge fan of Bulgakov and a trip to Russia without visiting Patriarch's Pond and spending quality time in Moscow is like visiting Canada without having a thousand people tell you to "Have a good day." - impossible. Of course, there is more than just Patriarch's Pond which draws me to Moscow, this is simply one small reason why I wish to spend time in the city.

I have been told by one of the people who works for the school that "Moscow is more Russian and Slavic in nature than European St. Petersburg." What do you think of that comment?

I look forward to learning this complex and fascinating language and more about the culture and history of the Russian people.

it seems i wrote the same above (or in other words) that StP is the most European city in Russia. Not sure about Slavic for Moscow :-)) I am sure there are some other cities that could have name Slavic :-)) Patriarch Pond is in very central area of Moscow. Have you addresses of the places you will be learning Russian by the way?

Re: St.Petersburg being more European...Yes its true, I thought that is what you were implying in your answer, forgive me for seeming a bit slow witted this morning and allow me to blame lack of sleep for seeming to not understand your answer...yes this is indeed what you had said.

The school representative had mentioned to me on the phone that the school in St. Petersburg is located on the West end of town but this is all.

I am considering changing my starting dates from March to starting in September of next year. Its better for my family etc. I think the autumn season in Russia will be as beautiful as it is here in Canada if not more-so!

Also, the pictures I have seen of St. Petersburg look familiar, I think this is where "Window to Paris" was filmed! Am I wrong?

september sounds warmer :-)) and of course more beautiful in comparision with March. hmm, West END - scary words :-)

As I was kid, I grew up near Moscow, so I am biased of course.

For architecture, I think Moscow offers more, is centrally located in the country and many major centers of interest: Vladimir/Suzda/Jaroslavl/Pereslavl/Rostov the Great are withn few hours by train/bus.
Other historic places (Novgorod, Pskov, even Kiev, which is not Russia - but it was the capital of Kiev Rus) are one night "away" from Moscow by train.

Much later, as I was living in Hungary my g/f (now she has a much more "advanced" status) and myself used, probably even abused the train system while on vacation: it was not easy to find a hotel, esp. for a non-married mixed-citizenship couple (RU+H) back in 1980. So we bought train tickets and used trains in lieu of hotel. :-) That allowed us to see a good part of the country.

SPB is not as "centrally" located.

An interesting idea. Did you know, the famous Russian river cruises are much cheaper in countries either traditionally "friendly" to Russia or formelly in "East Block" than overseas? For instance, Moscow-SPB river cruise bought in Hungary, Serbia or from some companies in Russia locally is about 3-4 times cheaper than the one bought in the States or Canada - on the same ship. I know. "1000ut" and "r-tours" are selling these.

http://www.1000ut.hu/
http://www.rtours.ru/
http://www.rtours.co.yu/

Just to get you the ideas of prices - 4 night/5 day New Year Celebration in Moscow is 660 Euro/person INCLUDING the airplane ticket and tax. That's the price level of Russian vacation we are used to :-)
http://www.rtours.co.yu/programi/aranzmani/nova_godina_u_moskvi.html

Regarding the river cruise a bit more here in Russian:
http://www.rtours.ru/page531.html
In Hungarian:
http://www.1000ut.hu/ut-hajo.htm

Sorry, all English-speaking sites I know try to sell these for $4000 and up, to get US$1000-US$1500 price range for the same trip, the web site is "magyarul" "po-russki" or "srpski", that's the way it is :-)
You always can join the "cheap" goup, by the way.

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By the way - little bit on practical side. Arranging the airplane tickets, esp. 3-month ticket is better via "consolidator" than via Internet. You may try www.mishatours.com from California. He has excellent offers to Central Europe, from there take train. This way you can actually either go "for free" to Moscow (the Central Europe->Moscow->Central Europe transfer would be free) or pay ca. 200 Euro and go anywhere in Russia you like (even Vladivostok). Going the "other" way cheaply is also possible:

Vancouver->HK by Oasis Air, HK->Beijing->Moscow(plus excursion to Kiev), than Moscow->Budapest->Munich (also train), than Munich->Vancouver by Air Transat.

There are special tickets called "CITY-STAR" which make the Beijing->Moscow->Kiev train price a joke (from 100 Euro now, expected to increas to 130 Euro + reservation + ca. $100 Beijing->UB->Russian border). These are being sold in Slovakia, Bulgaria, Serbia, Montenegro only - but we can get them. :-)

St.Petersburg is safety city - I lived here many years and I'm still alive :-)
SPb is better, as for me - Moscow seems to be noisy, crowdly etc.
You welcome our city!